This site is no substitute for a formal apprenticeship
This site is no substitute for a formal apprenticeshipThis site is not a substitute for a professional apprenticeship with a licensed tattoo studio. Nor is this site a definitive source for learning the art or trade of tattooing. An apprenticeship is the ONLY universally accepted way to learn proper safety practices and sound technique.
While we welcome members of all levels, we STRONGLY advocate staying away from skin until you've received formal training from someone who works in the field. Hell, even hair stylists must complete over a year of courses, pass a state health board exam, and apprentice under a professional studio before earning a chair.
The trade of tattooing has a rich history and traditions that have been passed down from generation to generation. If you respect the art, please show your respects by learning the right way.
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Machines No Longer Work, feeling like an asshole right about now |
 Oct 27 2009, 09:01 AM
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#1
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this is definately something im doing wrong, as both machines worked before I took them apart, spent literally the last 3 hours fiddling with this, adjusting that, getting fucking nowhere. trawled through past posts and did things like making sure all screws are iron or steel (I have a brass frame), checked power supply is good, clipcord is good. coils work on both thats not the problem. so im thinking its something to do with the several thousand washers and things that keep the right distances for the screws. any my problems are
first machine; shader- no movement, nothing, tried moving abar further and closer to frame not a fucking peep. was shady before being took apart but did actually work liner- abar "sticks" to coils when footpedal is pressed down instead of going down then up again like I say tried everything I can think of/ read of but theres definately something so fucking obvious I just havent done it help -------------------- "Life is the hardest teacher, she gives the test first and the lesson afterwards"
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Oct 27 2009, 09:11 AM
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#2
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ok the shader i'm not too sure - my old liner is doing the exact same thing (will sort it when I get time).
But the liner sounds like your wiring is wrong on the rear post where the wire is attached are there little plastic T-washers (not sure what they're called) but they look like a T when viewed from the side this will stop your screw touching the frame as it passes through the hole into the post and then the same on the front post. It sounds like you've got a wire touching the frame somewhere causing a circuit through the frame as opposed to the binding posts and spring, so when your pressing the pedal the circuit isn't broke when the contact on the spring and screw is. this is just from my limited knowledge of machine function - i'm sure one of the builders will know and advise more. |
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Oct 27 2009, 09:16 AM
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#3
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 That's all I got for you brother. I'd say you've got something in the wrong place. -------------------- |
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Oct 27 2009, 09:30 AM
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#4
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if the a bars sticking ur contact screw it too out u need to set it back some because the magnetic force is not being cut so lossen the contact screw and see if that helps .. if u realluy fiddle with em forever and cant fix em u can send em here ill fix em n ship en back of course u must pay for shipping both ways
-------------------- www.inkedbythenerd.com swallowsndaggers tattoo forum Swallows and Daggers Support The Traditional Movement Tattoo Artist, Painter, Asshole and Machine Collector |
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Oct 27 2009, 09:41 AM
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#5
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Look around in Show and Tell and The Marketplace for machines that were for sale by the respected builders here. Compare those pics of assembled functioning machines to what's going on with your machine. The a bar is sticking to the coils, so there's something going on with the grounding or some shit. My guess is you have some parts in the wrong spots. Figure this one out on your own, with suggestions from the forum members, and you'll learn a whole bunch.
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Oct 27 2009, 09:44 AM
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#6
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QUOTE (The Nerd @ Oct 27 2009, 01:30 PM)  if the a bars sticking ur contact screw it too out u need to set it back some because the magnetic force is not being cut so lossen the contact screw and see if that helps .. if u realluy fiddle with em forever and cant fix em u can send em here ill fix em n ship en back of course u must pay for shipping both ways if your a bar is sticking to the coils when the pedal is pressed you have bare wife touching somewhere & grounding. on the shader, pm me if you want, ill help if i can -------------------- im pretty much done on this forum, you can reach me thru my website
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Oct 27 2009, 09:50 AM
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#7
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I've had these same problems in the past.Could be a few different things,one of your plastic shoulder washers could be cracked,you cant always see the crack,but even the smallest crack will give you the problems.Another could be like already stated a wire touching the frame,contact screw to far in,i know you say both sets of coils are good,but if the shader is doing nothing it could possibly be a snapped wire,they are very easy to break when taking off or putting on the frame.
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Oct 27 2009, 10:12 AM
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#8
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Next time you can do what I do when working on a gun for the first time. If I happen to have access to another just like it, I only dissasemble one and use the other as a guide. If I don't have another like it, I take pictures throughout the dissasembly proccess and refer to them upon reassembly.
This post has been edited by Bravo4: Oct 27 2009, 10:12 AM -------------------- It becomes very difficult to pat someone on the back for a job well done when their own hand is in the way.
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Oct 27 2009, 01:08 PM
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#9
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magic, problem solved, thanks for the help guys
I'd made the same mistake on both machines, the screws holding the front and back binding posts needed insulating from both sides with those rubber washers. some on both machines fell off and hadnt been put back on, hence my liner sticking to my coils but not being pulled up by my uninsulated front binder. -------------------- "Life is the hardest teacher, she gives the test first and the lesson afterwards"
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Oct 27 2009, 01:58 PM
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#10
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QUOTE (Tez @ Oct 27 2009, 01:08 PM) magic, problem solved, thanks for the help guys I'd made the same mistake on both machines, the screws holding the front and back binding posts needed insulating from both sides with those rubber washers. some on both machines fell off and hadnt been put back on, hence my liner sticking to my coils but not being pulled up by my uninsulated front binder. Been there. Glad you got it sorted. -------------------- |
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Oct 27 2009, 02:10 PM
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#11
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lol whenever you take ANYTHING appart - make a note of where it goes or lay them out like an exploded view diagram
that way you cant go wrong next time - helps to study how things work too - i do that automatically following a fascination as a child taking things appart to see how it works lol good you got it sorted in the end though -------------------- Expecting the world to treat you fairly because you are good is like expecting the bull not to charge because you are a vegetarian
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Oct 28 2009, 02:22 AM
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#12
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..or do it the old army way - lay each part out in a line left to right as you take them off.To reassemble simply work back right to left.And be careful with the coils when you remove them,that link wire between them snaps just for fun (I got a box of them like that) and if theres a circlip on them make sure its not touching wire as the insulation easily rubs through.
Sorry to be mouthing off after the fact,I didnt see this thread earlier or I would have tried to help mate. -------------------- GENTLEMAN LOSER -- INTERNATIONAL SLUM DOG -- ON A FARM
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Oct 28 2009, 02:40 AM
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#13
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heh kindof stupid on my part, I knew it was something really simple I was missing. at least I now know how to take a machine apart and clean then assemble it
shocker I put some rubber bands around the coils to stop the wires getting pulled out, mark put masking tape on bare wires to make sure also made a yolk for my coils out of some washers, heard that was a good idea when you have a brass frame I say this post by mark gets stickied, took awhile to hunt it out but helped instantly ------------------> machine checklist -------------------- "Life is the hardest teacher, she gives the test first and the lesson afterwards"
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Oct 28 2009, 02:44 AM
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#14
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QUOTE (Tez @ Oct 28 2009, 07:40 AM) heh kindof stupid on my part, I knew it was something really simple I was missing. at least I now know how to take a machine apart and clean then assemble it shocker I put some rubber bands around the coils to stop the wires getting pulled out, mark put masking tape on bare wires to make sure also made a yolk for my coils out of some washers, heard that was a good idea when you have a brass frame I say this post by mark gets stickied, took awhile to hunt it out but helped instantly ------------------> machine checklist on a brass frame, your yoke needs to be 1 solid piece, not washers -------------------- im pretty much done on this forum, you can reach me thru my website
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Oct 28 2009, 03:12 AM
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#15
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yeah by putting just washers on your just extending the height of the coils - as markt4 says it needs to be 1 solid piece so that the coils are joined together - try to think f the coils as one of those horse shoe shaped magnets - they need to be joined otherwise they are effectively 2 seperate magnets - on steel and iron frames the frame itself acts as the join whereas brass copper and other non-ferous metals dont so need the yoke to join them for maximum performance
-------------------- Expecting the world to treat you fairly because you are good is like expecting the bull not to charge because you are a vegetarian
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Oct 28 2009, 04:25 AM
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#16
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i always insulate my screws on the posts with heat shrink tube,just enuff for them to get thru the frame,leaving the end exposed for the binding posts,so even if the standoff washers break or crack or whatever happens,the screws won't arc out,and yep ya need one piece of metal,with 2 holes fer yer yolk,it's a magnetic bridge
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Oct 28 2009, 04:30 AM
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#17
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As Markt4 says,yopu definitely need a yoke!I saw a brass machine for sale on ebay recently from tattooist of "25 years experience" (funny how they all have exactly 25 years under the belt,innit?Never 23 or 26) which had no apparent yoke,I emailed to ask what a bar and yoke it had to be told in reply that you only needed a yoke as a space for short coils.
Anyway,back to the point....do you have room for a yoke on your brass machine?I assume that there must be some space as you have washers in.....?Can you measure the height of the spring deck from the base?Then subtract the height of the coils and the a bar?That should give you roughly the yoke you can fit in.In my opinion (for what its worth) the bigger the better.If you have a wide base then a thin yoke can be made wider to up the bulk.So measure that too. Once you have gleaned this info,post it up or PM me and I will see if I can make a yoke for you.In that case you may as well tell me the distance between the coil mounting screw centres so I dont have to make slots instead of just two holes! -------------------- GENTLEMAN LOSER -- INTERNATIONAL SLUM DOG -- ON A FARM
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Oct 28 2009, 04:30 AM
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#18
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As Markt4 says,you definitely need a yoke!I saw a brass machine for sale on ebay recently from tattooist of "25 years experience" (funny how they all have exactly 25 years under the belt,innit?Never 23 or 26) which had no apparent yoke,I emailed to ask what a bar and yoke it had to be told in reply that you only needed a yoke as a spacer for short coils.
Anyway,back to the point....do you have room for a yoke on your brass machine?I assume that there must be some space as you have washers in.....?Can you measure the height of the spring deck from the base?Then subtract the height of the coils and the a bar?That should give you roughly the yoke you can fit in.In my opinion (for what its worth) the bigger the better.If you have a wide base then a thin yoke can be made wider to up the bulk.So measure that too. Once you have gleaned this info,post it up or PM me and I will see if I can make a yoke for you.In that case you may as well tell me the distance between the coil mounting screw centres so I dont have to make slots instead of just two holes! This post has been edited by shocker: Oct 28 2009, 04:31 AM -------------------- GENTLEMAN LOSER -- INTERNATIONAL SLUM DOG -- ON A FARM
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Oct 28 2009, 08:07 AM
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#19
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haha funny, the guy I got my shader off had ten years experience- so he said. the machine was rusty as fuck when I got it Abar had like battery acid on the back spring or some shit was crusty and white. most of the screws were rusty had to replace those, frame wasnt in much better of a condition and he used loc-tite on the contact screw so you need pliers to tune the machine LOL
that said it did run pretty good believe it or not. how much more effective are your coils with a proper yoke? didnt realise it made that much difference thought it was just a spacer QUOTE PM me and I will see if I can make a yoke for you PM sent -------------------- "Life is the hardest teacher, she gives the test first and the lesson afterwards"
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Oct 28 2009, 02:24 PM
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#20
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Sounds like he did have 10 yrs experience.....all on that one machine without ever cleaning it.
Coils.....a hell of a lot more effective,a hell of a lot.Orders of magnetude (magnitude - magnet-tude - magnets...geddit?Geddit?)....sorry,i'll get my coat.....(exits stage left) -------------------- GENTLEMAN LOSER -- INTERNATIONAL SLUM DOG -- ON A FARM
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